Hide these banners for a week

kopa/vitani and nala

my opinions about kopa and vitani and nalas relationship


tlklover :




okay, so this is my first article. I have been reading a lot on this site and watching YouTube videos and one issue that really interests me is "kopa" the cub at the ending of lion king 1. it is so obvious that this cub is different from kiara. yes i understand that the drawers were different, but still they could have made it look somewhat similar, right? the main difference that makes me believe it is a different cub is the way it is presented. at the end of lion king simba and nala are at the edge of pride rock and rafiki brings out a very calm cub, who is light yellow with black rings in its ears. yes this could be a girl since no gender was established, but why then at the beginning of lion king 2 have a completely different revealing of the cub and expect no questions?! kiara is brought to rafiki by nala, and she is playful and orangey. my opinion is Disney intended the cub to be a boy, but wanted to change it because it would have been to similar to the original story. that's fine i get it but come on at least give us a little insite instead of saying that was kiara. we are not blind! Disney was just to lazy to give us a story and expected us to just be like ok whatever. but to true lion king fans every cub counts! am i right?



now onto the next discussion, vitani. she in my opinion is one of the most beautiful cubs in the lion king movie, pale fur and blue eyes. there is just one problem with that, she looks nothing like her mother zira. the only outlander trait that vitani has is her nose shape. so here is what i think, and IM gonna say it even though the idea has been rejected. i truly believe nala is in fact vitanis birth mother. here is the scenario i picture: scar is the king, so he can do what he wants basically. after having nuka with zira he was displeased due to how skinny he was. this was probably because of the lack of food at the time. nala was one of the youngest lionesses and had strength. he though she would produce a healthy and good looking heir. so scar used his power to mate with nala. she hated scar and did not want his cub so after vitani was born she ran away to find help, and finds simba. scar brought vitani to zira who had given birth to kovu not to long after vitani was born, and she was able to nurse vitani. zira wouldnt object to anything scar asked of her. vitani has blue eyes like nala and her hair tuft like nalas brother mheetu. the cub could be sarafinas but i dont think so because of when vitani says "wheres your pretty daughter nala". in my opinion this is not just to aggravate her this line has a meaning. i think she is saying where is your good daughter the one you chose over me because im "ugly", tainted by evil because of scar. i think that is also why vitani always says kiaras name. for example " kiara has started her hunt" "no mother kiara is right" . everyone else just says simbas daughter.



well thats all i have for now, tell me what you think but dont be rude.






Similar articles :

Return




3568 visits

Close this window

Report a problem

Report this article Report this article

Last comments

February 07, 2014
Usa Is not currently on the site
Thanks :P

May 29, 2013
Australia Is not currently on the site
This is one of the best theories I've seen about Vitani's parents; I don't completely agree and there's no proof that either Zira ISN'T related to Vitani or that Scar IS. But I still like the idea... ;)

January 29, 2013
Usa Is not currently on the site
yeah i guess, but i still agree with myself :cool: . because mufasas parent had an outlander nose and simba never got it, nor did kiara. i dont think the grandparents geans really come into play. but its just my opinion

January 16, 2013
Is not currently on the site
ok but what if one of her parents has a mother or father with the outlander trait and it skips a generation and vitani got it and not her mother and father
ok does this make sense TlkLover

Advert
Advert
January 16, 2013
usa Female Is not currently on the site

January 16, 2013
Usa Is not currently on the site
i dont believe that tama and tojo could be vitanis parents maybe one but not both, because of vitanis outlander nose shape.

Blue Eyes
Blue
Eyes
October 03, 2012
Is not currently on the site
This is, in order, who I think the cub was at the end (from strongest to weakest):

1. Kiara's older twin sister, who Simba betrothed to a nearby prince and sent a to the nearest pride (to be betrothed to the prince)...but something happened to her on the way there. Or she got ill, and died.
2. Kopa, who caught ill or ran away.
3. Kiara's twin brother who caught ill.
4. Kiara (Last because I really don't believe it, but it's probably very possible.)

Iluvlionking
Iluvlion
king
July 18, 2012
Is not currently on the site
Okay, here are my thoughts on Kopa as the cub on the end:
I'm sorry, but my opinion is that was Kiara. For one, I'm pretty sure that one of the creators said for the lion king 2- "We pick back up where the last movie left off with a twist- we think it's a king but it's actually a queen!" I don't know if those are the exact words, but I got my point straight. i have a much longer theory, but I'm not going to go through it all.
My thoughts about Vitani and Nala:
I think Zira was Vitani's birth mother. After all, in the movie, Vitani says, "where's your pretty daughter, Nala?" Why would she say that if she was her own daughter?
Not being rude or saying it is a fact, just my opinion. :Be_happy:

veronica
Veronica
July 16, 2012
Is not currently on the site
i belive that the story of kopa really did happen.but he didnot die he survives. thats what i belive anyway.

June 27, 2012
Is not currently on the site
Yes! Nala has to be the mother not Zira not hates for Zira though.:icon106: :icon106:

Sariaan The Forgotten Cub
Sariaan
The
Forgotte
n Cu...
May 28, 2012
Is not currently on the site
This is my theory: Tama had become old enough to mate during Scar's reign, and things had gotten very much a bit strange around lately.
So, even though she knew Chaka loved her (yes I do believe Chaka existed and fancied Tama) she ran off and got Tojo as a mate, and the pair were so intensely in love they tried for a cub and gave birth to baby Vitani!
Tojo and Tama loved their daughter very much, but Chaka was very strongy jealous (DUH!!!!!) and told Zira that Tama had given birth to a young boy more healthy and handsomer than Nuka (Chaka had never liked Nuka). SO Zira, determined to give Scar an heir and almost insane with the obsession, burst into Tama, Tojo's and now Vitani's cave at night and killed them off - but decied to keep Vitani anyway, after she found out the truth that she was a girl, and she ran Chaka out of the Pride Lands for cheating her.
The reason Vitani said, "Where's your pretty daughter, NALA?" Like that is because she had just found out what had happened to her as a baby and was thinking, "Ah yes your pretty daughter because she is so lucky to have her real birth parents who love her, but I am stuck with Zira who wants to kill you just like she killed off my parents, who might have loved me and we would have been a family even happier than yours if it wasn't for Scar's reign, and Kiara shows off about it because she's so royal." In other words, she was jealous because Kiara had a family better than what she ended up with. Then she stood against her mother because 1. She didn't want to obey a killer anymore and she decided war was pointless and 2. She finally realised that she may have been disgracig her parents. That's my theory.

April 16, 2012
Usa Is not currently on the site
you could be right, but mheetu nalas brother has a hairtuft. so nala could carry that trait maybe unless mheetu gets it from his dad.

alisha
Alisha
March 29, 2012
Is not currently on the site
i agree with most the stuff your saying but i think vitani`s parent are tojo and tama bcuz tama has that tuft of fur on her head just like and vitani does 2 and both tama and tojo have some of the same colors as vitani.







February 04, 2012
Is not currently on the site
I have already said all I need to say. So I'm happy to leave it at this.

February 04, 2012
Slovenia Male Is not currently on the site
I think it is pointless to go further in this topic with these essay sized posts. All I am going to say is that we cycle around our own personal preferences, values, perception and stuff. We just give different weight to what authors say, or the possibilities. So we are just different, where you see straight story I see possibilities and TLK is full of possibilities to expand basic story, to connect stuff which Disney never thought or even abandoned. Either through untold stuff, lose ends and conflicts within universe as whole. Same as right and wrong, it is all different from which point of view you look at it.

Also about proofs. I always say not every piece of proof removes alternatives. Best example is with money, you can easily prove you have 100 EUR, simply you open wallet and show it. And there is no doubt. But totally different story is if you owe me 100EUR and I come to collect it, when you do not have money... how you prove it? You could show me empty wallet, but that does not really probe it, does it? It only points in some direction. I could easily say that you are maybe hiding money in your pocket, or on bank account, or anywhere. It is actually quite harder to prove you do not have it. Same is with movie does not give any indication of something. Does not prove anything, but it points in direction. It is up to watcher to make conclusions or evaluate alternative possibilities.

That is all I have to actually say in this matter. Continuing it would only cycle us through similar stuff and same disagreements.

February 04, 2012
Global moderator Usa Female Is not currently on the site
Yeah... right. Seems it does.

February 04, 2012
Is not currently on the site
Perhaps, but pride has nothing to do with these matters.

February 02, 2012
Global moderator Usa Female Is not currently on the site
Pride cometh before the fall

February 02, 2012
Is not currently on the site
@ Brown Wolf:

The right of free speach applies to me and other fact-promoters just as much as it does to those who like to voice opinions that argue against facts or try to pass personal opinions as facts. When you do one of those, you can't seriously expect yourself to be left alone with it.

If it wasn't me calling people out on such practice, it would be someone else. In fact it always is more than one person. Even on this very article's comment table I'm not the only one who pointed out the fact how the Vitani's-mother theory isn't very sensible, I wasn't even the first one to.

I repeat: You can't expect to be left alone if you knowingly and deliberately ignore facts and tthen ry to pass your view as belief instead of just an alternate universe fan vision.

And yes, even in this little theory, the words "I truly believe" are present and followed by reasoning that argues against facts.

February 02, 2012
Is not currently on the site
PART 5:

---”Again move gives no indication, because it is not important for main story where Vitani came from, it only shows that Zira takes care of her and that Vitani calls her mother.”---

And that is enough to cause doubt about their relationship, because...? Because they don't look-alike much is really the only reason available. But as said, is just made of fail to begin with as looks can come from anywhere in the family tree.

---”You really do not understand, do you. No one is trying to pass this for official. So I do not see why it bothers you. What we should write unofficial on top with bold letters of size 20?”---

Wherever I claimed that I'd think this is trying to pass itself as official? And I've explained time and time again that I commented on this because its large complaint about the cub matter and addressing the concept of a true fan intrigued me and stirred thoughts. And as for the Vitani's-mother part of this, it doesn't bother me (in these situations when it's not passed as official.) But as it still argues against facts, (like using Mheetu who's never meantioned in the movies in any shape or form), stirred a thought about the practice's flaws, so I felt like commenting on it. The First Amendment gives me the right to raise up that point which was valid even if opinions on the practice's sensibility may differ.

February 02, 2012
Is not currently on the site
PART 4:

---”More important than showing why Simba is overprotective is to point out his fear about Kiara and to direct it towards Outlanders. Because I see Simba being a little bit too overprotective for just one event like that. At least that is in my opinion.”---

But it was not just one event. It was all the dangerS that Simba had gotten himself and Nala when they were young, the dangerS that HE had gotten them into while Kiara reminded them of the way HE had been as a cub. That was all literally stated in the film in the very scene wherein the slight overprotectiveness was first shown. That's why he was so worried about Kiara going hunting all alone even though she was already a teen. Not to mention the way Zira had looked at her when she was a cub and what she'd said about ”barely begun” while also literally saying ”these lands belong to Scar” and attempting to attack Simba. So hence, there was totally more than one event to provoke Simba's protectiveness over his spirited child who was also number 2 enemy to Scar supporters.

February 02, 2012
Is not currently on the site
PART 3:

---”Apparently I and many other fans can find conflicts. It is not really hard to find a lot of different explanations abut it.”---

But it is impossible to find any that hold water in even slightly deeper look into the matter. Other than that it is a remake. Because that's what it really is so they did not leave room for any other explanations to make sense. (Now refering to only the conficts with the cub.)

---”Events shown in movie are ones which are crucial for main story. Ones without which main story could not be understood properly. But that does not mean they show everything because they have time limitations.”---

Yes, but everything ESSENTIAL to the story would be included within the time limit. Exactly so that people would understand it properly. Like, if there had been another cub, it would have been literally revealesd whatever happened to it. There was nothing about another cub, so to anyone who cares about the story behind what we see, more than about superficial elements on sceeen, the movie's events are all it takes to understand that there was always only Kiara.

February 02, 2012
Is not currently on the site
PART 2:

---”If someone is making theory about how Kopa could be cub at the end of TLK and that Kiara happened after that, then goal of that theory is to explain it and fit it in movie events, which makes it correct, but not official.”---

How does it make it correct when that theory would always be horribly flawed by numerous facts IN the second movie's content, especially when compared to the books' content? As in when Kopa could never fit into the movies and make sense. The concept of 'never' naturally including unofficial attempts. Because seriously, when official side did not mean him to exist in it, thety did not leave room for him, and thus it becomes literally impossible to fit him in at all.

---”And do note their is difference between unavoidable and not trying. Also TLK 2 is not suppose to be remake, but rather it should continue story. So one scene would not really kill them...”---

I agree. I have accused SP's makers of stupidity (in other discussions), but nonetheless it is a remade scene of the original in the first film and nothing's ever gonna change that, so no sense in believing against it. Prefering against it, sure, but not believing against.

February 02, 2012
Is not currently on the site
@ Seth 2208:

”So what is more common sense, to believe what authors told you or to believe what you see?”

To believe what the story's authors told you. Because they're the only ones who know what's really there underneath the surface, while without them you can only form your own personal interpretation which may be nowhere near what really is there. As in, to know the truth for a story, ask the creator of the story.

Fancy words and ideas about common sense you speak there in your previous comments but it still does not make it common sense to argue the visions of a story's creator. Let me try and put it another way; A fact is something that is never going to change - so where's the sense in not believing? In SP's creators vision the two cubs are the same character and therefor in SP's story they will always and forever be the same character, and there is no common sense, no any kind of sense to not believe it, no matter how hard it may be.
The bottom line is: Fighting a battele you can never win is senseless, I believe we all agree on that. And as an opinion or a personal feeling can not change a fact, arguing a fact is a battle you can never win. That's why I think the only common sense thing to do is to just accept the fact and simply prefer an alternate vision by fanfiction.

February 01, 2012
Slovenia Male Is not currently on the site
@BrownWolf
Couldn't said it better myself.

February 01, 2012
Global moderator Usa Female Is not currently on the site
Better yet, we should ignore those who love discrediting the fanbase because our opinions are not official. My gosh, whatever happened to free speech and respect of others. Newsflash, it's not that difficult a practice

February 01, 2012
Slovenia Male Is not currently on the site
PART 4
Again move gives no indication, because it is not important for main story where Vitani came from, it only shows that Zira takes care of her and that Vitani calls her mother.

Because looks come from genes and thus can come from anywhere in the family tree. Hence, Mufasa and Scar share the same father but look entirely different.
True, I often explained that whenever someone was using looks to point out. But then again you expanded my explanation with looks. I only removed some value from ”well, Vitani calls her mother and nothing else is said about it so she's her birth mother". I did not go towards any looks explanation, because there you can find as many points for as you can find against.

And then there are those who try to pass the unofficial as official which are mainly what I've been fighting against in my articles and comments outside this article.
That's why I can't let it go.
You really do not understand, do you. No one is trying to pass this for official. So I do not see why it bothers you. What we should write unofficial on top with bold letters of size 20?

February 01, 2012
Slovenia Male Is not currently on the site
PART 3
Apparently I and many other fans can find conflicts. It is not really hard to find a lot of different explanations abut it.

I stick to my opinion that the commentaries and interviews are within the universe because they source from the same place where the movie came from. So I see them as additional content to the practical universe, not just as explanations.
That is where we are different. I see them as additional content, which explains how they made move, what were they thinking, why they did something that way, to show removed seen scenes and ideas and stuff.

Events shown in movie are ones which are crucial for main story. Ones without which main story could not be understood properly. But that does not mean they show everything because they have time limitations. So not all stuff can be supported by explanation. More important than showing why Simba is overprotective is to point out his fear about Kiara and to direct it towards Outlanders. Because I see Simba being a little bit too overprotective for just one event like that. At least that is in my opinion.

February 01, 2012
Slovenia Male Is not currently on the site
PART 2
As far as theory goes, you have very scientific view towards them, but there are is also philosophy. Beside main point of theory is to explain something, that is what theory tries to do, and goal of theory depends on its author, he is one who decides where that theory is aiming and where it is not. If someone is making theory about how Kopa could be cub at the end of TLK and that Kiara happened after that, then goal of that theory is to explain it and fit it in movie events, which makes it correct, but not official. Yes authors might have said cub at the end of TLK is not Kopa, but our theory does not try to argue that, that is not goal, it was never aimed towards that. Otherwise please go ahead and explain whole world how using theory in conspiracy theories is wrong, because they are more "visions"... Theory is more loose term than you give it credit for being.

And yes I did saw remakes, some better and some worse. But quite often they had more in common with original, than for example both presentations have in TLK movies have, except for them being presentations. And do note their is difference between unavoidable and not trying. Also TLK 2 is not suppose to be remake, but rather it should continue story. So one scene would not really kill them... And as far as authors go, they can expect whatever they want, I experience stuff as I see them, not how I am told to. I believe this goes under my right of free will. I take facts from movie and form conclusions based on that. Then I see commentary, which may or may not effect my thinking.

February 01, 2012
Slovenia Male Is not currently on the site
@BrownWolf
You are welcome. Thanks for your input too.

@El
Name a country wherein it's considered sensible to believe or claim that an original story's creator is wrong about his/her own creation's means?
My explanation it was general, not pointed towards specific example. But since you insist, I can't name country. There is no direct answer towards your question. But answer is more hidden in people. It is common sense that once you see something, you form your own opinion. As well as it is common sense to interpret something you see through what your knowledge, experiences and stuff. It is also common sense to form your own opinions. So what is more common sense, to believe what authors told you or to believe what you see? Problem becomes clearer, when you for example see how different two presentations are, yet authors tell you they are suppose to be same... Now how to solve that really depends on individual. It tells me that they do want them to be same, but visually are not. So I personally take what I see. I look at movies, like at art, you read or see it, you interpret it your own way and make your own conclusions. Author of course can also explain how he did it and give you his own opinion. But it is common sense that you are one who makes your own opinion, which can be influenced by other people or not.

January 31, 2012
Is not currently on the site
@ Brown Wolf:

Where have I said I can't stand the way you're replying to this article? For all I've seen you're the ones who can't stand the way I replied to this article.

---"Who says you're right and we're wrong?"---

The movies' creators.

---"Simba's Pride's creators did not know what they were doing and they did not stick to the... animation and characterizations of the first film."---

I think they stuck to the characterizations. And animation is unavoidable to differ when animators are different.

---"Why can't you just let it go and let the 'unofficialness' be visualized into the officialness. There's no harm and no one is taking away anything. Additions, last time I checked, aren't a bad thing."---

Theorizing is not adding, it's mingling one's own ideas with official matrial in efforts to prove itself correct to the official material WHICH causes unnecessary confusion WHICH is why when you call something a theory when facts stand in the way, I will throw the facts in. If I happen to bother, as in it's not like I bother to read or comment on everything. This one just intrigued me and stirred thoughts.

And then there are those who try to pass the unofficial as official which are mainly what I've been fighting against in my articles and comments outside this article.

That's why I can't let it go.

1 2 3

Return

Close this window

More smileys

Post a comment!

Name :

:) :( :o °x° :! ;) :/: :p :mad: :P :cool: :cry: :red: lol More



How much is : ?       Tired of filling this? Register on the site!




Advertisement


Activity on the site

Latest forum posts :
Pride Heart RP super animal lover - 3 days
YES! This is a Fan-made video! B L H - 19 days
TLK: Kiara's Reign; OPEN command - 28 days
What do you think happened to Scar's body? B L H - 29 days
What TLK Merchandise do you own? Kieran - 30 days
Is Frozen Crushing TLK?! Rainbow-Turbzz - 32 days
A new generation: Kovu's Pride Troll Berserker - 35 days
Clare's pride Troll Berserker - 35 days
Open Pride RP Troll Berserker - 35 days
Drago`s Flaming Fur pride. HermioneGranger - 36 days


Latest site comments :
Thanks, Malta ^_^ I'll tr... Bambiraptor - 2 h
Can I try for 7? YearooTheCub54 - 3 h
Using! YearooTheCub54 - 3 h
6. MalkaxNala 9. Kulax... -Legolas10- - 6 h
9 is KovuXKiara 6 is Kov... Maltathecub - 6 h
Thanks! :) austin.max246 - 8 h
Thanks ^^ indehmono - 8 h
9- Vitani X Kopa?:p artic wolf - 10 h
Yay! Thank you so much, I... Wild Wind - 10 h
Hey! c: Welcome to the So... Darku-Dumplings - 10 h






 
NewsGuestbookForumsContactLinksRegisterLog in Connect with Facebook
Languages : Français   English
 
   
Close this window

Choose a style

Choose a style
Shout box : Anna Andersson (20 h) : Hey Inde
This unofficial fansite is managed exclusively by Lion King fans, and is non-profit.

The advertisement on site is only there to pay for the site maintenance cost, including server hosting and domain name.

Any copyrighted material included on this site is reproduced without permission, but only serves entertainment purposes, and is used with utmost respect for the original creators.

The site requires cookies for his general usage, such as member login, poll votes, ... If you don't agree with this, please block cookies from your web browser.

All rights reserved by Disney, owners of Lion King series and films.

Generated in 0.089 seconds
Close this window

Log in

Name : *
Password : *
Auto reconnect :


* = required fields

Or connect with Connect with Facebook


Password forgotten? Click here to get a new one